Feeding Question about my new boa

[razeraze]

Pythonguy I was debating using deep substrate like with my monitors for my snakes, but I worry about it getting caught in the belly scales since there is no legged animals in the cage to pack it down or dig it up and cycle the dirt. I find the problem with common bedding (aspen, wood chips, cypruss mulch) is it absorbs bacteria and holds it, so it needs to be replaced frequently unlike the pondliner which can just be wiped down.

[pythonguy21]

raz
"All right I can tell why many monitor keepers do not deal with snake keepers."
"a petty argument with the likes arrogant snake keepers."
"Here let me put it in idiot terms for you."

you say snake keepers are arrogant but re-read your post tom, you know i like you so as a friend im saying you are also coming off arrogant.
you make me feel after reading all these post because i dont own a monitor i know nothing about snakes.
none of my snakes live in small sweater boxes, and all have custom enclosures to suit there needs. i firmly disagree on feeding whenever you "think" they might be hungry. or feeding until they stop eating. i think this whole thread has been back and forth stabs and has really done nothing for the reptile community other than to take stabs back and forth at each other.
most zoo's and so called snake vets, ect, know nothing about them at all, most experienced keepers like brett and others have been doing this longer than we have been alive tom. i trust them more than some guy who got his phd in general animals and think they then know it all about everything. but even so you can always learn something from someone, you just have to know which pieces to pick.


"The bottom line is I could put any snake into my monitor cages and it will do fine, I could even put my monitors in my snake cages and they will do fine. Is it magic? No it is a properly set up cage."

i would find that reckless and careless, i dont think snakes and monitors chill out together like home boys in the wild. saying something on a sight like this tom is not good, wait until some unexperienced moron comes along and says well this guy says it possible and then starts keeping all thier animals of different species in types in one cage and then comes back when there all dead like wth. not good advice

[pythonguy21]

Originally Posted by razeraze

Pythonguy I was debating using deep substrate like with my monitors for my snakes, but I worry about it getting caught in the belly scales since there is no legged animals in the cage to pack it down or dig it up and cycle the dirt. I find the problem with common bedding (aspen, wood chips, cypruss mulch) is it absorbs bacteria and holds it, so it needs to be replaced frequently unlike the pondliner which can just be wiped down.

well tom i use substrate for all my snakes based on their needs, i have never had scale rot or a sick snake. it doesn't get caught in their scales, at least i have had problems with it. as far as bacteria i think some bacteria is not a bad thing, i used eco earth in my cages before, i would completly change the cage once every two months and spot clean regularly, i never ever had a health issue or problem. i think creating a white straight jacket sterile room type environment is bad, you need bacteria to keep their immune system going.
but as far as the others being replaced frequently i don't really care if i have to do it everyday or every week or every month for when you love your animals you just don't care about being inconvenienced by them.

wait until you have a kid tom, i have to change my baby's diaper every 5 minutes sometimes, sometimes its hours, you never know but it doesn't mean im going to stick her in pond liner for convenience.

i treat my animals how i would want to live and try to give them the best i possible can, and let them make their own choices. i know most of mine love burrowing during the day, and coming out and basking at night, they are all extremely friendly, they always eat, i have 0 regurges EVER. so i must be doing something right.

[JuliusSqueezer]

Yeah ...gotta watch that bacteria since there is none in the wild so our snakes have no resistance to it. Wonder what it would take to pond line the everglades. I'm feeling really bad for all the burms down there crawling through muck to get to a gator

[razeraze]

If I am going to use substrate it is going to be dirt, now I have explained why I will not use other substrates and why I am hesitant about dirt.

Now you completely misunderstood my monitor post. If we did not adopt the blackthroat, Precious would be in juggernauts cage. Nothing would have changed except for maybe taking the dirt out (Maybe). There would be no monitor in the cage and I am ceretain she would have done fine in the cage. One of the other reasons we did not use such a deep cage was because Lou was dragged into a deep cage which made it difficult to get to the snake constricting him. So despite the retic being able to live in that cage, for our safety we are building a different cage. All of these decisions were talked about before we adopted the blackthroat.

Do not assume you know, and don't worry I am constantly cleaning cages any ways, I just find constantly dumping substrate in the trash to be wasteful and not necessary. Here is another good quote
"Razeraze, there's a very simple answer to your question. If I want to go out herping, I will choose different times of the day to herp for different reptiles, even if it's the same day and in the same locale. In the middle of the day on the hottest summer days, when the sun is directly above and it's uncomfortably hot you will rarely, if ever, see something like a red-bellied blacksnake out basking or foraging, but that sort of day is almost guaranteed to get you a few sightings of active monitors. Diamond pythons, which share a lot of the same habitat as lace monitors in my area, are nocturnal during the hot summer, but will happily wander around by day in winter.

So, we have the same locale, same general climate, yet each reptile uses it differently - accessing a different microclimate temporally. They may have to deal with the same ambient temperatures, but their basking temperatures are entirely different." crocdoc

"Thank you. I thought it would only be different for diurnal and nocturnal species, I did not think two diurnal lizards would not do well in a similar enclosure. If the cages are set up with natural environment in mind and the cool spots are offered as well as the hot spots wouldn't the reptile thermo regulate as it saw fit? For instance if you kept a bearded dragon and a lace monitor, wouldn't the monitor just use the spots it felt necessary and the bearded do the same?" me

"Ideally, yes - provided the lace monitor didn't eat the bearded dragon first, which is the most likely scenario

There's one problem, though. In captivity we are limited by space, so we tend to make each enclosure have as much of the preferred conditions for the animal being kept. Bearded dragons and monitors are not as far off each other as a snake and a monitor would be, though, in terms of basking spot preferences. Monitors just like it generally hotter. You'd probably find that you'd see less of the bearded dragon and more of the monitor if the enclosure were a bit on the hotter side, and vice versa if the enclosure were a bit cooler.

I have a favourite wild lace monitor spot that I take visiting herpers to when they're in town. If it's a hot sunny day, we'll see lacies. If it's a bit overcast and not quite as hot, sometimes the lacies aren't readily found wandering about so I'll stop at a waterfall that's on the way back and will be almost guaranteed to find a pair of water dragons that lives there. That way we're not completely skunked. On hot days, the water dragons are much harder to find, as they aren't out in the open but are wedged into crevices. Consequently, it's usually an 'either or' thing." crocdoc


So a snake a lizard or what ever can be thrown into a large cage they will just use it differently. Currently in the BCI cage we have a hot spot of 150F+ I told my fiance it was too hot and she put it in anyways. Do you know what happened? The snake never uses it, it is just dead space. The snake does not go up there and cook, or burn herself she simply does not use it.

	Boa Constrictor Imperator

[seamushunter]

wow someguy asking feeding advice turned into this?? :scared:

i think we should all kiss and make up

(ya right)



i have a statement to make but this is already to heated so i'll refrain myself you guys should try that!!!

[JuliusSqueezer]

You have a 150 degree basking spot for a boa? That's ridiculous...and yeah ...dead space. Why not cool that area down and allow the snake more room to use? What's the point of having a huge cage and then making it so all that space can't be used? 100 degrees ambient causes brain damage. 111 causes death. 150 is just overkill if your goal is to kill your pets.

I wouldn't use dirt for a large snake. They tend to make a lot of mud when they come out after a soak. Maybe the reason some of your monitor buddies don't like snake people is that the snake people are more in tune and you guys just get frustrated for not hearing what you want to hear or being told you are wrong all the time? Be right for once and maybe we will grow on you Personally, the only other monitor person I know of that doesn't like me is that dances with savs whackjob and it's all quite mutual. A lot of my friends keep monitors. Please refrain from projecting your feelings on such a huge group. They can speak for themselves. You can only speak for you...and that dances with savs whackjob guy. I'll give you that since you two are probably joined at the hip anyway.

[razeraze]

I know it is a waste of space, but she claims it helps the tempgradient. I think if we remove it we will have to change the light set up or put in another branch to deflect some of the heat so the second shelve stays at the temperature she prefers. How ever it poses no harm to the snake because the snake can get away from it.

Dances with savs is a nut job and you have little business comparing me to them, how ever who are your monitor friends perhaps I can ask them why you think a large cage can not be set up correctly using monitor guidelines. I am asking a cage guru now how big of a difference it makes, when I hear back from him I will let you know.

Again you are confusing ambient temps with surface temps. The surface temps are 150F the ambient is 80-90F

[pythonguy21]

i don't understand why anyone in their right mind would have a surface temp of 150.

it is not right and should be adjusted to something more appropriate.

i keep the ambient temp at 88 during day it hits 85/84 at night basking spot of 95. i think that is plenty for a bci. and she is quite happy, with her habitat.

	Boa Constrictor Imperator

[razeraze]

I agree 150F is not useful. The highest I have documented and published is a surface temp of 122F (Mcginnis 1969) again though it just means we are wasting space not endangering our reptile.